Someone shared this chart on a Perennialist discord server. Thoughts? Is it good?
Religion chart.
Things and concepts at the edge of reality — and credulity. The bizarre and the spooky, mysteries, cryptozoology, weird coincidences, aliens, esoteric knowledge, truths with horrific implications, ghosts, and whatever else seems to fit.
i think its wrong about intiation tbh. thers no initiation by people that matters
I mean, you would still need to prepare with something right? Otherwise people would be able to go around getting mystical experiences without preparation.
I have had mystical experiences without initiation, or at least the "spiritual side" has contacted me
Could you describe those experiences?
People who say things like this assume themselves to exist in a vacuum
true, even things like one's first love can be initiatic.
Here's your (You)
Oracular powers are God's gift. You don't earn them through some human process.
I like the three axis thing, do you have a source?
inclusivism without initiation = new age fluffy babble
exclusivism without initiation = overly rigid and blind hierarchies
initiation weeds both of these out, as not every path is equally true but no sole path has an exclusive claim to truth.
This isn't really a three axis graph, thoughever
It's two dimensional, but I guess it has three poles.
Three dimensional would be like a cube or a pyramid.
>larpagan cope
Christianity HAS surpassed your fake comicbook religions kek
>implying most Christians on EerieWeb aren't larping
In many countries, you've needed government or foundation "help" to keep your doors open.
At least we have doors, all pagans have left is some random clearing in the middle of the woods, and some weird guys basement
Pretty ironic that this kind of petty quarrel seems to be what the chart is trying to advert lol
Considering that most perennialist authors became muslim, the fact that it defines the abrahamic faiths as counter-religions makes it not very good. If I understand Guenon correctly he described the emerging postmodernism as the counter-religion while false initiatory paths were described as pseudo-religions, and he considered that initiation in christianity was no longer accessible. The only religion I recall him deeming as false in its origin was buddhism, though other perennialists disagreed on that.
They became Sufi Muslim, which is different from your "all religions but Islam are wrong" kind of Muslim.
In some Muslim countries everyone belongs to a Sufi order. Sufism is not a branch of Islam but a dimension of Islam. Anyhow, the correct Islamic teaching is that God sent prophets to all corners of the earth but their teachings were generally lost or corrupted to varying degrees. So it is not for us to say that Ahura Mazda or Brahma is not really God or cannot be worshiped by those who follow those religions, where things go wrong is when people associate other things with God and commit idolatry, so Islam was sent to correct the record on that subject, but there are some who were not in need of that particular correction. My personal opinion is that perennialism misses out on the traditional Islamic teachings of the subject of the relationship between Islam and other religions.
NTA but isn't there at least a claim in Islam in favour of Islam having driven all other religions obsolete. Like for example when Islam first appeared it destroyed the pre-Islamic Arab religions, and it clearly states polytheism is a sin.
Some Islamic school of thought go as far as advocating for the destruction of other religion's icons. Like when ISIS blazed their way through archeological artifacts in Syria, or when the Taliban destroyed the statues of Buddha in Afghanistan.
The fact Islam perceives what they call idols sinful is already a grave mistake, especially because iconoclastic Muslims seldomly seem to understand what people are doing when they pray in front of a statue, and give offerings to a God.
Islam picks on women and children, but can't cast out demons. It's obsolete itself. A religion of words, but not power or deliverence. The entire Middle East is inflicted with those things. So much to the point that they got used to them over time and ended up trying to call them good or pretend they're not demonic. But they are what they are. Even the previous pagans who lived in these areas knew what they were.
>NTA but isn't there at least a claim in Islam in favour of Islam having driven all other religions obsolete.
Yes, it did. But people who don't know of Islam still following their old ways are not in bad shape if they worship God alone. At the same time, they are considered blameworthy if they do not accept Islam, and are supposed to be made to pay jizya.
>Like for example when Islam first appeared it destroyed the pre-Islamic Arab religions, and it clearly states polytheism is a sin.
Yeah, paganism does not have a place. It is clear that pagans living among muslims have no rights unless they are guests of the muslims, and may be forced to accept Islam or another acceptable religion.
>The fact Islam perceives what they call idols sinful is already a grave mistake,
Not really, idolatry is pretty clearly the biggest mistake anyone can make. Real christians don't pray to statues of Jesus and kiss pictures of Mary, peace be upon them. Nor do respectable Indians pray to cows and eat their feces.
Well, there you go. Islam is very aggressive against religions that are not strictly monotheistic and iconoclastic.
It closes it off not only against polytheistic traditions, but also it closes itself off to the branches of Chrsitianity that are the most mystically inclined, Catholicism, in which statues of the saints, Mary and Jesus are very important, and to Orthodoxy, which makes an even greater use of icons.
And it's funny because you yourself, like most iconoclasts, do not understand how icons actually work and you think people are praying to the literal object.
Captcha:R4MAS
Even if you do not pray to the object, you venerate the creation of your own hand which cannot hear or see. And it certainly creates the impression in the common people who are made to bow before statues. I've heard your arguments about how somehow, staring at and contemplating a crappy drawing of some random guy who doesn't look like Jesus (as) just inspires some great divinity in you or some other meaningless drivel like that and somehow makes God relatable to you through a drawing you made.
Islam does not treat Christian icons like idols in terms of jurisprudence.
The icons clearly work, and have worked for thousands upon thousands of years.
You are just confirming what was written in the OP. Orthodox Islam closes itself off to all other religions to a degree where Islam is the only correct path. What does "real Christians" even mean to you? Since obviously Catholicism and Orthodoxy aren't, Iconoclastic Protestantism is the "real Christians" to you? The branch of Christianity that's probably the least mystical of them all. Even them are proably inferior to you because they still hold the dogma that Christ is God.
The only correct way to approach God to you is Islam. That's it. And Islamists make an effort to destroy or make access difficult to all other religious paths which aren't Islam. Which is why they force taxes on you if you are "of the book", or straight up murder you and destroy your temples commit the "sin" of being a polytheist.
If you want to read about actual theory on what icons are and how they work I would recommend Pavel Florenski's book "Iconostasis".
>hates icons
>uses black cube to pray to God
What did Islam mean by this?
>where things go wrong is when people associate other things with God and commit idolatry,
Go back to licking your rock and spare the rest of us your cognitive dissonance Abdullah
visually attractive chart.
Interesting categorizations, first time I see them.