Thoughts on Judas?

Many theologians and Christians have a hateful attitude towards him and are convinced of his damnation. But does his repentance and suicide mean nothing? Did Jesus forgive him? Do YOU forgive him?

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  1. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Despair is not repentance. That was his greatest sin. And among anyone's greatest sins. Complete self-defeat and to think God would never help you out of the mess you made. Peter, while not as severe, also let Christ down with his denial. And yet he was forgiven and made the shepherd of the Church.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Despair is not repentance
      But the Bible does say he repented

      Then Judas, who had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders.
      - Matthew 27:3

      And if he repented, does that not mean he will be forgiven?

      I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.
      - Luke 13:3

      Jesus didn't forgive him.

      Matthew 26:24
      The Son of Man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.”

      I read this more as Jesus predicting how Judas will feel after his betrayl. After all the idea of wishing you had not been born is a classic notion of suicidal and guilty people

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I saw it as Judas not being forgiven and had he not been born he wouldn't have to suffer the fact that he committed something unforgivable.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It's not quite the same word that's translated. The usual word for repent is mετανοεῖτε (metanoeite) which entails a sense of reforming oneself. While Judas μεταμεληθεὶς (metamelētheis) simply regretted.
        There was a reason why St. Jerome translated regular "repentence" as "penance". Which required more action and change of oneself. Or Greek Orthodox themselves have a similar concept.. and that's their own language, so they would know best.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Despair is not repentance. That was his greatest sin. And among anyone's greatest sins. Complete self-defeat and to think God would never help you out of the mess you made. Peter, while not as severe, also let Christ down with his denial. And yet he was forgiven and made the shepherd of the Church.

        How exactly was he supposed to actually "repent" in this case though? Jesus had already been arrested, and the pharisees didn't want his money

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          He didn't repent, he was just remorseful. "Repent" is a mistranslation.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You didn't even attempt to answer my question. I asked, how was Judas supposed to actually repent?

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            In the same way anyone's does. Lay their sins at the feet of God and try to live a Christian life. Not rocket science, not the easiest thing in the world either. Judas felt bad, but didn't believe God would forgive him. He didn't believe a God of mercy and forgiveness was good enough at mercy and forgiveness to have mercy on him and forgive him. That was his greatest betrayal.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You're making a hell of a lot of assumptions there buddy

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Non-argument

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Ok talk like a gay why don't you

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Also not an argument

  2. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Jesus didn't forgive him.

    Matthew 26:24
    The Son of Man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.”

  3. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    He didn't repent. He's (most likely) in hell because he didn't think God could forgive him. That was his greatest sin of all, even greater than betraying Christ. He never fully believed. Ultimately, we on earth don't definitively know who is and is not damned. Judas could be in paradise. Whatever happened in his heart prior to his suicide is between him and God. But in the event he is in hell, it's because he considered his own sin so great that God couldn't possibly have the power to forgive it. That's the most significant lesson to derive from the death of Judas. Whatever you have, lay it at the feet of the almighty. Do not hide away in the brushes like Adam or bury it within your heart like Judas. Whatever "it" is, it's infinitely less powerful than Him.

  4. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    In some Gnostic texts he is not a traitor.
    in reality he was one of jesus' favorites or the best and chosen of jesus.
    but jesus asked him to betray him and warn the roman and israeli soldiers.
    judas when he saw what they were going to do to jesus then entered into sadness and committed suicide and in gnostic texts they put allegories to that. i.e. in some gnostic texts judas is not bad, he is rather very useful and an important part of the acts and life of jesus.
    but of course, these are apocryphal texts that neither catholics nor protestants read. only gnostics and academics of religion read them.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >in reality he was one of jesus' favorites or the best and chosen of jesus.
      Gnostics chose different figures of the "favorite" depending on the school. Sometimes Mary Magadalene, sometimes Judas, sometimes Thomas.
      Never Peter. They themselves knew he was a symbol of the universal Church.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Gnosticism is mental garbage. Earliest gnostic texts are hundreds of years after the life and death of Christ. It's a larp made by a sect of depressed Greeks.

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >texts are hundreds of years after the life and death of Christ. It's a larp made by a sect of depressed Greeks
        well, christianity is literally that kek.

        • 2 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >well, christianity is literally that kek.
          No, Christian texts are compilations of the writings and correspondences of Christs disciples and historically relevant texts. You know the followers didn't exist in a vacuum and communicated their ideas to other people, right? Modern Christianity is a bunch of translations of texts from and around the time period of Jesus's life.

          >Earliest gnostic texts are hundreds of years after the life and death of Christ.
          In fairness to that anon the Gospel of Thomas is placed by some scholars as being older than all the canonical gospels

          >placed by some scholars
          What a load of gibberish. "Some scholars" believe that neanderthals were a race of super predators that hunted early homosapiens into near extinction. Just a bunch of junk. Pop-science and pop-theology for the moronic masses to consume like Marvel movies.
          >being older than all the canonical gospels
          The Gospel of Thomas takes place after most of the canonical Gospels, so no. Also, the Gospel of Thomas is so blatantly blasphemous that it should be obvious that it isn't canonical or written by any of the apostles alive at the time. None of them wrote anything close to what happens in Thomas. It's apocryphal for a reason.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            you just believe who ever is in political power

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You poor oldtroon. Still seething over Bush after all these years. That gunk in your bong didn't lead you to enlightenment after all, did it.

            >None of them wrote anything close to what happens in Thomas
            We only have word of mouth and tradition that the apostles actually wrote the gosepls we have today. It's an act of faith to believe that. And I do, but at the same time it is entirely possibly that they weren't. I have my suspicions about Mark, at least the very last part of it

            >We only have word of mouth and tradition that the apostles actually wrote the gosepls we have today
            And we only have word of mouth and tradition that the founding fathers wrote the Constitution. That's what history is. If you want to see the original texts, open a bible. The Bible is almost exactly the same now as it was 2000 years ago, the only difference being minor alterations through translations.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >None of them wrote anything close to what happens in Thomas
            We only have word of mouth and tradition that the apostles actually wrote the gosepls we have today. It's an act of faith to believe that. And I do, but at the same time it is entirely possibly that they weren't. I have my suspicions about Mark, at least the very last part of it

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >the Gospel of Thomas is so blatantly blasphemous
            ^ This guy is okay with all the shit in the Old Testament, but not with the highest teachings of Jesus. Sad.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            This is bait

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Entire thread is bait

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Nobody in here actually read the Gospel of Judas? It's not that long.

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Then provide a tl:dr scholar man

          • 2 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Nobody in here read this apocryphal text written by a bunch of Greeks two hundred years after Christ was crucified
            Ok anon

      • 2 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >Earliest gnostic texts are hundreds of years after the life and death of Christ.
        In fairness to that anon the Gospel of Thomas is placed by some scholars as being older than all the canonical gospels

  5. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Anyone with even cursory knowledge of the occult knows that Judas was Jesus' one true follower tasked with sending God incarnate back to the pleroma.

  6. 2 weeks ago
    judas

    hey everyone I'm new here and I cannot find my car keys...

    maybe over by

    [...]

    ?

    huh...

  7. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Betrayed for some shekels. Sounds like modern times dealing with people.

  8. 2 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Here are the facts:

    1. Jesus had to die. It was part of his mission, and he knew this. Matthew 16:21

    2. Jesus knew he would be betrayed. Matthew 26:21

    The disciples knew full well of the divine nature of Jesus. They had seen his miracles, they had listened to his sermons. To simply betray him would be beyond foolish. Judas had to have done it in accordance with the mission of Jesus, so that humanity could be saved. That doesn't take away the mental burden, however, even if it was necessary.

    From the perspective of Jesus, if one of your goals is to unburden humanity of sin, then which would be better? Having your follower betray you with consent, or waiting for someone else to do it without consent? Waiting for someone else to do it would have invited more sin into this world and condemned someone who could be spared. Besides, Jesus choosing to die for humanity gives his death much more significance as opposed to if he had zero control over his own death.

    • 2 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >The disciples knew full well of the divine nature of Jesus. They had seen his miracles, they had listened to his sermons.
      So did the Pharisees. Man is double minded. Seeing isn't always believing.
      >To simply betray him would be beyond foolish.
      Yep it totally was. But he did.

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